Next post
if anyone had a serious thought that there could actually be something called a ‘truth commission’ on torture held by The One’s administration, nancy pelosi and her abject lies have completely impaled that idea.
even the hags of code pink call out pelosi!
former intelligence committee chair and director of the CIA porter goss calls for ‘security before politics’ in a weekend wa po article.
here is a highlight:
“Today, I am slack-jawed to read that members claim to have not understood that the techniques on which they were briefed were to actually be employed; or that specific techniques such as “waterboarding” were never mentioned. It must be hard for most Americans of common sense to imagine how a member of Congress can forget being told about the interrogations of Sept. 11 mastermind Khalid Sheik Mohammed. In that case, though, perhaps it is not amnesia but political expedience.
Let me be clear. It is my recollection that:
– The chairs and the ranking minority members of the House and Senate intelligence committees, known as the Gang of Four, were briefed that the CIA was holding and interrogating high-value terrorists.
– We understood what the CIA was doing.
– We gave the CIA our bipartisan support.
– We gave the CIA funding to carry out its activities.
– On a bipartisan basis, we asked if the CIA needed more support from Congress to carry out its mission against al-Qaeda.”
i know we’ve talked about this last week however, this demonstrates so clearly what all the howling and spitting democrats have been doing the last couple of weeks was really about — appeasing their lefties like code pink.
it was not about seeking the truth or making our country stronger; it was not about being transparent; it was nothing more than a political witch hunt. and now it has blown up in their collective anti-American faces.
there will be no hearings even though senators levin and feinstein are pretending to call for it.
let’s face it, the speaker of the house — the 3rd in line to obama’s throne — is a lying maroon. remember nancy, it’s not the original lie, it’s the cover-up.
pelosi lied, terrorists died got water up their nose.
_____
sorry this is up late. i am a little under the weather — and no, it’s not the swine flu. oink!
Ken says: Nancy knew about the interrogations, before she didn’t know!!!
Jane says: In reading your link to the Code Pink action alert, are you insinuating that this has all been manufactured in some elaborate plan to soothe ruffled feathers of an interest group???? That is so ridiculous and very insulting.
And for the love of God, please DO NOT MOCK those who are suffering and dying from the swine flue.
‘…are you insinuating that this has all been manufactured in some elaborate plan to soothe ruffled feathers of an interest group????’
yep.
If Pelosi is complicit in breaking the law and international treaties by authorizing terror, prosecute her!
Let’s get the facts out on the table. Water-boarding is torture. Someone (or several someones) authorized it. They broke the law and violated the Constitution.
Let’s remember why this is such a big deal. Assume, for a moment, that opinions of professional military and law enforcement interrogators and Senator John McCain which hold that torture is ineffective and produces unreliable information are wrong.
It doesn’t matter if these “enhance interrogation techniques” produced information. It doesn’t even matter if they saved lives. They are illegal; they are abhorrent. As John McCain said: “It’s not about who they are; it’s about who we are.”
You want to torture? That’s unAmerican. Cheney, Rumsfeld, Bush authorized torture? Investigate, prosecute, convict, imprison.
You conservatives are afraid of the truth.
lisab says: the interrogation techniques were developed by JFK’s administration.
micky says: Jane relax. How the hell was kate mocking anyone ?
Or is this just more typical liberal hypersensativity making people out to be victims of a simple statement ? Pfft.
More people die of normal everyday influenza related illnesses everyday than anyone has died of pig flu yet.
Pelosi is either lying, wasnt paying attention, or both.
micky says: “You conservatives are afraid of the truth.”
Right, thats why conservatives want transcripts of all the briefings brought out for everyone to see.
You liberals need to retract your fangs, this isnt going anywhere because theres just as many on both sides who were aware of the techniques being used.
Both intelligence commitees knew, they had their chance to object, they didnt.
PenniePan says: I don’t care about the Pelosi thing actually. What I do care about is Torture. We do not torture in this country and we do not manufacture it’s effectiveness to stay out of prison. It is a known fact that Dick the Dick Cheney did this which is why he wants handpicked memos to be released. He had this all planned!!!
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2009/04/a_glimpse_of_the_dark_side.php
He has basically authorized torture on your and my behalf. He had basically destroyed the fabric of our nation with his evil ways. I want him indicted.
Rope says: oopsie
Pelosi, it’s such a dirty word. Makes ya wanna go ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.
Kate let me apologize ahead of time, Im going off subject and I might get a little personal.
Penni, Ive been gone but just read your “backwards hell hole called Texas” comment. Well you can kiss my Republican, George Bush loving, Red White and Blue, Lone Star State arse.
Thank goodness he’s back home.
Sorry again Kate, but as a Texan just couldn’t let that slide.
Ken says: “I don’t care about the Pelosi thing actually.”
Gosh, what a shock!
I’m sure if Obama had done it and it resulted in thwarting a terrorist attack he would be praised throughout the left as the “great savior”!
“we do not manufacture it’s effectiveness to stay out of prison.”
Manufacture? Hardly. I’ll post it AGAIN since some of you seemed to have missed it.
http://hotair.com/archives/2009/04/22/obamas-dni-reminds-obama-that-enhanced-interrogation-worked/
“President Obama’s national intelligence director told colleagues in a private memo last week that the harsh interrogation techniques banned by the White House did produce significant information that helped the nation in its struggle with terrorists.
“High value information came from interrogations in which those methods were used and provided a deeper understanding of the al Qa’ida organization that was attacking this country,” Adm. Dennis C. Blair, the intelligence director, wrote in a memo to his staff last Thursday.”
Here’s another one:
Keep trying though, it’s very entertaining.
‘Well you can kiss my Republican, George Bush loving, Red White and Blue, Lone Star State arse.’
well said sistah.
PenniePan says: Ken you obviously do not read other links with different points of view. What a joke! Don’t ask for proof in the future if you aren’t going to read the proof given to you.
My point is that Dick the Dick manufactured the memos he’s requesting. Why don’t you try reading things other then conservative marching orders?
Ken says: That means a lot coming from you Pennie. Perhaps you could address my posts about OBAMA’S National intelligence director saying that waterboarding DID produce results.
I did read your post and all it did was present another opinion, similar to yours, of some non-existent conspiracy. Is that what you wanted me to read?
You better have more than that. What a joke!!
PenniePan says: Of course I read your links. They were recounting exactly what Cheney said almost verbatim. Blair? He and Cheney are friends. Cheney was the DOD at one time and do you actually think he didn’t have the power and authority to create whatever paper trail he needed to get all of this through? You are very naive Ken.
Jay says: “Pelosi lied, terrorists died got water up their nose.”
LMFAO. That’s awesome!
micky says: Pennie.
Your source does nothing but express perspectives and opinions.
You have no proof that effectiveness was manufactured or that there was even intent.
The Pelosi thing is worth worrying about otherwise she wouldnt of been the first up at claiming ignorance.
Any fool who knows anything about the way our government works should know that when you have as many dems as cons that stand to be prosecuted proceedings will not take place.
Case and point would be the bullsh*t you guys tried to get away with by asking for Bush to be impeached because he manufactured evidence to go to war.
The fact is that just as many dems as cons were aware of the fact that the intelligence was flawed and not manufactured and that if anyone was convicted just as many dems as cons would be guilty. But theres nothing to guilty of.
Just as many dems as cons were privy to the exact same intelligence and all voted on non partisan lines to go to war.
The same applies to this case. There are so many dems that knew this was going on as it was not illegal at the time that theres NO WAY IN HELL proceedings will go forward. If they do, it will one dem going down for every con going down.
Grow up, think, at least try
“It is a known fact that Dick the Dick Cheney did this which is why he wants handpicked memos to be released. He had this all planned!!!”
Stop makin sh*t up !!
Show me where Cheny said he only wants those specific handpicked memos released ????
I’ve heard him interviewed many times on this already and hes never said any such thing ! Whats he has asked for is for the mitigating memos showing results to be produced/released and not any in particular !!!
“Ken you obviously do not read other links with different points of view. What a joke! Don’t ask for proof in the future if you aren’t going to read the proof given to you. ”
What planet are you from ? Do think were stupid or is it you ?
By asking Ken if he does not read other links with different points of view you are admitting that your source is a point of view, and by no means has a “view” ever been proof of anything.
When you are willing to convict someone without sufficient evidence such as you are, it is you and your ilk that are ruining the fabric of our country which was constructed in many ways to never let such crap happen
micky says: “I’m sure if Obama had done it and it resulted in thwarting a terrorist attack he would be praised throughout the left as the “great savior”! ”
He doesnt have to do anything and it still happens
Pat says: If waterboarding and the other “enhanced interrogation techniques” were ok, why did the operatives destroy the videotapes? Are we suppose to just take their word for it, imagine that it was the ticking time bomb scenario, and that they did get information that saved lives by following procedures that were in compliance with their “safety” guidelines?
The things they did are torture plain and simple. Until I see irrefutable proof that significant lives were saved from terrorist attacks on US soil, they should all be prosecuted.
PenniePan says: Micky I don’t believe I was discussing this with you. And just for the record, my link was just as much ‘fact’ as Ken’s. So quit trying to bash me.
Ken says: “They were recounting exactly what Cheney said almost verbatim. Blair? He and Cheney are friends.”
I see. So Blair must be lying, right? That is what you’re saying, isn’t it? So his opinion is biased. Yet you have no problem using a liberal, anti-Bush website like TPM as your “source”. I guess as long as you believe it, it’s ok.
“You are very naive Ken.”
LOL! You would rather see thousands of people die in terrorist attacks rather than dump a bucket of water on a terrorists nose and I’M naive?!?!?!?
Let’s not forget Pennie, before you hijacked this thread, it’s about what PELOSI knew, remember? I realize you don’t care about that, since shes a democrat, but let’s stay on topic.
Ken says: “The things they did are torture plain and simple. Until I see irrefutable proof that significant lives were saved from terrorist attacks on US soil, they should all be prosecuted.”
It already exists Pat, please see my link above. As usual, people like you and Pennie, refuse to see what’s in front of your face because it doesn’t fit your “view”.
I put it out there, if you refuse to look at it, there’s nothing more I can do.
The Dem leadership was kept abreast of all that was going on. To pretend they didn’t is a joke. Of course Nancy knew.
More faux-outrage from the libs. They’ll claim they want anyone involved to be presecuted, but they’re lying. This is still a Bush witchhunt and will remain that way. But it’s what the party has to do to keep their unAmerican kooks all worked up. They’ll come up with some excuse as to why they can’t go forward, some of the whackos will be upset, but the majority will do as they’re told and pull the Dem lever come November 2010 & 2012. These individuals are sheep who falsely claim they care about the Constitution and only repeat what they’re told to say about waterboarding being torture. If anyone needs to be thrown in prison, it’s the modern day left.
Jared says: Oh geez. I have been away for a few days and all you rightwingers go nuts! This is such a no-brainer…
Would you want your son or daughter rounded up by a future administration to be labeled an enemy combatent and subjected to “enhanced interogation techniques”, also known as TORTURE, in the event that administration feels they might get a confession out of them?
Would you want one of our soldiers, labeled an enemy combatent by a foreign government because they deem him so just to piss us off? Subjecting them to repeated slapping, sleep depreivation, freezing temperatures, sexual humiliation, and anything up to just shy of death (so long as the intent is not to actually kill them)?
The “ticking time bomb scenario” takes care of itself. If torture is illegal and some interrogator knows the subject contains the information and tortures it out of them no jury in the country will convict imo.
For me though its basic… ABUSE OF POWER by Shrub and Darth. Now we all know why those videotapes were really destroyed. They wanted to control the message.
micky says: Pennie;
“Micky I don’t believe I was discussing this with you. And just for the record, my link was just as much ‘fact’ as Ken’s. So quit trying to bash me.”
Oh PUHLEEEEESE !! Grow the hell up would you ????
In the comment I refuted you on you made no claim as to who you were adressing at all !!!!
And no ! Your source was not “FACT” , you admitted it was a “view”. Kens source is not only BLAIR !! its also every other director of the CIA, Porter Goss and on down the line who are a hell of a lot more believable than anything you’ve produced.
Please, dont expect anyone, us or a court to believe some ditsy blogger who issues an opinion on what certain memos mean to him.
Your case is pathetic. If you took this in front of congress or even some third world court you would be laughed out of the courtroom and onto the curb.
The judge/jury will take testimony from all the heads of all these depts very seriously that say the methods worked and discount your source in a heartbeat simply because its a case of opinionated hearsay.
Wise up.
Hot Air;
” Dennis Blair, the Director of National Intelligence, pointed out that most of what we know about al-Qaeda came from using those techniques on Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Abu Zubaydah”
Ken says: “Would you want your son or daughter rounded up by a future administration to be labeled an enemy combatent and subjected to “enhanced interogation techniques”, also known as TORTURE, in the event that administration feels they might get a confession out of them?”
Sure wouldn’t. as long as my kids weren’t planning a terrorist attack against our country they don’t have much to worry about. Now, would you want YOUR son or daughter to have to jump out of a hundred story building that was on fire to escape the pain of burning to death?
“Would you want one of our soldiers, labeled an enemy combatent by a foreign government because they deem him so just to piss us off? Subjecting them to repeated slapping, sleep depreivation, freezing temperatures, sexual humiliation, and anything up to just shy of death (so long as the intent is not to actually kill them)?”
Sure wouldn’t. Last time I checked the last American soldiers captured were murdered and had their bodies mutilated. Gosh, at least they didn’t put them in a cold room!!!!
“Now we all know why those videotapes were really destroyed.”
Yep, they were counting on liars like Pelosi and cowards like Obama.
micky says: “Would you want your son or daughter rounded up by a future administration to be labeled an enemy combatent and subjected to “enhanced interogation techniques”, ”
Obama has already designated half the country as “radicals” because the term “enemy combatent” no longer exists.
And no, enhanced interrogation and torture are not the same thing.
let me ask you this.
If some guy told you he knew exactly when and where your mother was going to be raped and killed would you torture him to find out when and where ?
“The “ticking time bomb scenario” takes care of itself. If torture is illegal and some interrogator knows the subject contains the information and tortures it out of them no jury in the country will convict imo. ”
Your opinion aint worth sh*t in a court of law, or to any jury.
People go to jail all the time for shooting burglars in their own homes or for acts of self defense.
“For me though its basic”
Yes, we know
In a seperate topic, the Bower-in-Chief decided to terrorize the citizens of NYC by having AF1 buzz them for a photo-op today. Having to constantly apologize for this idiot being in office is getting old. He’s an embarrassment to the civilized world.
Jared says: “If some guy told you he knew exactly when and where your mother was going to be raped and killed would you torture him to find out when and where ?”
Micky I’ve read your blog. I really don’t want to encourage your rape fantasy whatsoever.
You obviously have a reading comprehension problem. I said I understand the ticking time bomb scenario. Frankly, I think it is the honest thing to do. I might even myself.
What my issue is with the Bush Administration cover up. They are dishonest. Darth Vader is hiding something along with quite a few others in that crooked administration. If Nancy Pelosi hangs herself oh well, I want the facts and the truth to come out.
“What my issue is with the Bush Administration cover up.”
Evidence please? Perhaps you can post a link to something OTHER than an editorial from the Huffington Post, or John Stewart, or Bill Maher, etc.
“I want the facts and the truth to come out.”
A liberal wouldn’t know the truth if it came up and bit him, they are only interested in tearing down Bush even after he’s left office. They have no interest in the truth.
That’s why you’ll never see your investigation, too many dems would go down if it did come out.
PenniePan says: It is amazing the the neo-con’s in here belittle any “facts” we lay out (though none of us are professional fact finders, journalists, etc) yet they think their facts are irrefutable. Wrong.
The fact is torture is wrong. We did it. We were wrong. This needs to be investigated and the proverbial buck stopped at the top with Shrub and Darth Vader. So quit whining Ken and Micky.
“It is amazing the the neo-con’s in here belittle any “facts” we lay out (though none of us are professional fact finders, journalists, etc) yet they think their facts are irrefutable.”
It is equally amazing to us what you consider “facts”. I haven’t seen many, if any, facts laid out by any of the neo-socialists on this site. Editorials aren’t facts and I take it by your comment that you have no facts to offer. No surprise there.
“This needs to be investigated and the proverbial buck stopped at the top with Shrub and Darth Vader.”
Thanks for proving my point, Pennie. This isn’t about right or wrong, it isn’t about justice or our “moral compass”, it’s about revenge. You want to take down Bush so bad, you can’t think of anything else. Obama released these memos to get this circus cranked up and you’re playing right into it.
“So quit whining Ken and Micky.”
So says the king of the whiners. The left has done nothing but whine since 2000 and even when they win elections, they still whine. I guess it’s their motto.
micky says: Jared.
“Micky I’ve read your blog. I really don’t want to encourage your rape fantasy whatsoever.”
So, by taking a sci fi story about aliens that probe our citizens and induce nightmares of rape and using it to call me a rapist answers the question ?
Why am I not surprised at how Jared makes an example of what bunch of gutless wonders liberals are ?
Join the club Jared. I think your answer has made in unanimous amongst all the moonbats on this blog that you guys dont give a rats a$$ about the truth. None of you will answer that question because the answer is what the holds the truth that all of you are too afraid to admit.
You, Pennie, Jane, and whoever else is on your bandwagon are some dispicable people who want nothing more than to see good innocent people be jailed for keeping you and your family safe.
I have to say, you make me sick, you think this is some game where whoever gets their lust for revenge satisfied is the winner and yet in the same breath you say you’re appauled by torture.
Your fake rage doesnt fool anyone. If all of you didnt make it so apparent how much you hate Bush we might be able to take your rage seriously.
Dont you see that ?
You guys are whats called “Hostile witnesses”, which simply means that anything you say cannot be taken seriously.
Pennie, you’re as hopeless as Jared is.
How convenient that you think the buck stops with Bush when its been shown to you many times that these methods were first used by JFK all the way up Clinton.
Justice for all, right ? Why stop at Bush ?
Because thats all you want is Bushs head on a platter and not justice or the truth.
We are not the ones making the assertion that Bush is guilty of anything.
Its yoiu and your party that are making that claim.
In this country the accuser is the one who saddled with providing the truth, not the accused.
You make the claim, you prove it.
Not me, not Ken, not Kate, YOU!!!
And you know what ? You cant and you havent.
You have an opinionated blogger and a few articles from liberal newspapaers.
Even though its not incumbent upon us conservatives to provide any refuting evidence we have provided first hand evidence directly from those who performed the methods and authorized them that they do in fact work.
You have nothing, no facts, not even a good argument.
What facts there are that do exist point to Pelosi being just as aware that these methods were being used as everyone else.
Look around. There are more people saying she was there at those briefings and was aware of what was being done than those that back her story.
I’ve heard at least 6 people now who were all at thaose briefings say shes full of it. I have not heard anyone come out to defend her yet, have you ?
Pennie;
“The fact is torture is wrong”
Lets try again.
Would torture be wrong if the man in front of you knew when and where your mother was going to be raped and killed ?
Would you torture that man to save your mothers life and dignity ?
Uh Oh,
http://www.gallup.com/poll/118006/Slim-Majority-Wants-Bush-Era-Interrogations-Investigated.aspx
“55% of Americans believe in retrospect that the use of the interrogation techniques was justified, while only 36% say it was not. Notably, a majority of those following the news about this matter “very closely” oppose an investigation and think the methods were justified.”
The people have spoken!!! Apparently all the neo-socialists on this site are in the “minority” when they oppose harsh interrogation techniques.
“Support for an inquiry into the Bush-era interrogation policy may be relatively limited because a majority of Americans believe the use of the techniques for questioning terrorism suspects was justified.”
Oh well. Better luck next time, fellas. Maybe you can demand an investigation on what Bush ate for breakfast, that might work.
Jared says: “So, by taking a sci fi story about aliens that probe our citizens and induce nightmares of rape and using it to call me a rapist answers the question ?
Why am I not surprised at how Jared makes an example of what bunch of gutless wonders liberals are ?”
Micky you are so disfunctional. Now you are spinning your own trash about rape into a sci fi story? Here’s the deal Micky just let it go. You wrote it, you are the one that screams the loudest around here about owning their own words, why don’t you try some of your own medicine.
Ken as I said I am not so hung up on the actual ticking time bomb scenario. Yes, even I can admit that I probably would do things I would not normally do to protect from a known attack. My issue all along is the disfunction and the secrecy of the Bush administration. I want an investigation with everything on the table. If Pelosi goes down so be it. But I would bet Cheney would go first.
Until I see irrefutable proof that significant lives were saved from terrorist attacks on US soil, they should all be prosecuted.
Pat – did it ever occur to you that the irrefutable proof you want is in the memos that Cheney is calling to be released? Memos that P.BO and his minions are so far refusing to allow to see the light of day.
It’s an interesting thing. Until 9/11 I too would likely have been in the camp of “torture is wrong no matter what”.
Then I lost someone I cared about very deeply – on Flight 11.
It changed everything. There are people out there who want Americans to die, period. If pouring a little water onto the face of someone who we know has planned the deaths of Americans and is likely planning the deaths of more – then I say go for it.
Until 9/11/01 we were a country in the dark, unaware or unwilling to admit that people in the world hated us just because we were American. 9/11/01 pulled us into the light and changed things – forever.
micky says: “Micky you are so disfunctional. Now you are spinning your own trash about rape into a sci fi story? Here’s the deal Micky just let it go. You wrote it, you are the one that screams the loudest around here about owning their own words, why don’t you try some of your own medicine.”
Wanna talk about medicine ?
Fine, lets do this. I’ll cough up and admit that I wrote a story about a woman who was having a paradoxial nightmare about a machine or entity that wasnt human that raped her in a never ending cycle.
There, ya happy ? I took my medicine. Frankly, I dont care what you think it was about or what you percieved it as but I’ll let you have it be whatever you want, fair enough ?
Lets say that it was a horrible story that I fantsized about being a part of. You still didnt answer the question
Now, its your turn to take your medicine..
Answer the question or consider yourself the loser.
You’ve made it adundantly clear that you know you cant answer that question honestly and say that torture is always wrong.
You lose buddy, you lose.
You know what the answer is and you’re just too much of a (redacted) to answer it and instead try to turn it around on me, dodge the subject, by obfuscating to something personal and calling me one who fantasizes about rape.
Trust me, you dont want to go there, Since you have such high regard for kids who are mentally impared I suggest you take your feigned self righteousness and put it out of the light.
micky says: “There are people out there who want Americans to die, ”
Yes, sadly enough some of them are liberals.
They either think America deserves these deaths and we have no right to cry about it or deep down inside love it when Americans die as a way to convey their message that the Bush admin was an abject failure. Every American death bolsters their claim, they love it.
“My issue all along is the disfunction and the secrecy of the Bush administration. I want an investigation with everything on the table.”
EVERY administration has a certain amount of secrecy, they have to. Americans aren’t entitled to know every little detail about everything that goes on for 8 years. You don’t think Clinton, or even Obama, has secrets (probably pertaining to National security) that he doesn’t want found out?
You open the door to having every administration being investigated by the successor. It won’t accomplish anything except divert attention and waste millions of dollars.
In agreement with Kris, and will add:
I support enhanced interrogation techniques of terrorists, terror suspects, terrorist sympathizers, terrorist appeasers, and terrorist apologists. I also support torture for all of the above. Water-boarding is NOT torture, but I don’t mind terrorists thinking that it is, and knowing that I’ll use it. I supported the fact that Madam Speaker SPECIFICALLY supported water-boarding before the fact. I do not, however, support the current regression to Clinton-era policies of chopping off the legs of our intelligence community, just to further smear the previous administration.
It is a smokescreen to divert attention from the raging ineptitude that currently exists in DC, particularly in the White House. And you moonbats, wherever your pretended concern truly lies, you are only a part of that smokescreen.
It is about the getting, or maintaining, of govenmental power for those on the left, and has nothing to do with leadership or accountablity or truth. Outing and ridiculing the tactics serves to undermine the effectiveness of the interrogations, and the threat (that threat of any form of “enhanced” interrogation, if you’re a terrorist) thereof. And that regresses our nation to the very state we were in on 9/10/01.
And if you say that it’d be okay to return to that blissfully blind idiocracy, then I say you’re a terrorist sympathizer, and want you water-boarded until you get a clue and stop wishing bad things on my country.
micky says: Yea Jeff
You can’t hide them lying eyes. In fact, you have to sleep with them open because of all the face lifts.
bob says: Jane you ignorant slut,
I am amazed that you are so blinded your love of all things liberal to think that Pelosi or any of your beloved Demos would have “manufactured in some elaborate plan to soothe ruffled feathers of an interest group”. It is ridiculous and it is very insulting that the democrats have risked our national security to appease the far right, to play partisan politics by creating this “witch hunt”, and to forward their own personal agenda. Jane, wake up!
42 Comments