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they’re being called the ‘bush-era interrogations’ and the memos describing the methods used by our CIA on the top terrorists at gitmo — once secret — are producing more fake outrage from those on the left.
the torture memos were made public by the justice department with assurances from The One himself that the intelligence officials who carried them out won’t be prosecuted. however, those same assurances don’t apply to bush administration officials who crafted the legal justification for the interrogation program.
here are the torture techniques used against the worse of the worse terrorists at gitmo:
first, prisoners were stripped naked, shackled and hooded to start their interrogation sessions. when the CIA interrogator removed the hood, the questioning began. whenever the prisoner resisted, the documents outlined a series of techniques the CIA could use to bring him back in line and they included:
• nudity, sleep deprivation and dietary restrictions kept prisoners compliant and reminded them they had no control over their basic needs. Ccothes and food could be used as rewards for cooperation.
• slapping prisoners on the face or abdomen was allowed. so was grabbing them forcefully by the collar or slamming them into a false wall, a technique called ‘walling’ that had a goal of fear more than pain.
• water hoses were used to douse the prisoners for minutes at a time. the hoses were turned on and off as the interrogation continued.
• prisoners were put into one of three in ‘stress positions,’ such as sitting on the floor with legs out straight and arms raised in the air to cause discomfort.
at night, the terrorist was shackled, standing naked or wearing a diaper. the length of sleep deprivation varied by terrorist but was authorized for up to 180 hours, or 7 1/2 days. the interrogation sessions ranged from 30 minutes to several hours and could be repeated as necessary and as approved by psychological and medical teams.
some of these techniques, such as stripping a detainee naked, depriving him of sleep and putting a hood over his head, are prohibited under the us army field manual. but in 2002, the justice department authorized CIA interrogators to step up the pressure even further on suspected terrorist abu zubaydah, one of the big fish at gitmo.
the CIA was allowed to place zubaydah in a cramped confinement box. because zubaydah appeared afraid of bugs, they also authorized interrogators to place him in a box and fill it box with caterpillars however, this particular tactic wasn’t needed because zubaydah sang like a bird before it could be used. just as a random thought, have you ever seen an oregon slug?? ew.
charlie gibson on abc news called all of this ‘chilling‘.
i think cutting off innocent peoples heads on video and driving airliners full of innocents into buildings at top speed is chilling. but that’s just me.
so The One suspends use of these ‘torture’ techniques and confines not only the military but all U.S. agencies — including the CIA — to the interrogation limits set in the army field manual, which is available online, and is already used by al qaeda for training purposes. to expose publically the memos, describing the techniques themselves, assures our enemies – the terrorists – are now aware of the absolute limit of what the U.S. government can do to extract information from them, and enables them to fine tune their training accordingly. this results in completely diminishing the effectiveness of these techniques used by our interrogators. and of course, by diminishing our ability to extract information from those who have it, this makes us less safe. period.
thank god we still have rendition, although i think it sucks that we make other countries do what we don’t have the political will to do ourselves.
James says: I see you are a 24 fan. You obviously are watching too much of it because you think that’s how the real world is. It’s not ok to torture brown people. It’s not ok to torture any people. Even the bad guys.
James says: Also to NOT prosecute those who ORDERED torture, and those who OBEYED orders to torture is no guarantee that it will never happen again. Letting tortureres off scot-free is dangerous.
The “just following orders” defense didn’t work at Nuremberg, nor should it work now. Obama is not showing a lot of courage, here.
The Constitution is more important than some sad need that conservatives have to feel safe.
Prosecutions, starting with the interrogators and working our way up to Rummy, Cheney, Condi and Junior himself. That is what is needed. Torture is against US law. Violators of the law must be prosecuted and, if found guilty, imprisoned.
Period.
>>kate said: … are producing more fake outrage from those on the left.
I’ve watched the left for so long that I agree, this is nothing but another faux-outrage based upon who was in office rather than what took place. If they had really cared about the Constitution (as they falsely claim they do), they’d have been all up in arms when Clinton lied to a Federal Judge. But no, you can’t even get them to admit it was a crime, much less a crime that, had the average John or Jane had done it, would have landed their butt in prison. This are individuals who hate America, hate the Constitution, really hate GWB, hate conservatives,….. They just hate for the sake of hating. If they didn’t have something to hate, they’d invent it just so they could tear it down in hatred. They’re trash and deserve to be treated as such.
There’s a reason the Dems haven’t and won’t go forward with any of this against anyone; they know their trial would be the laughing stock of the country, because they have no evidence, and it would make them look like total idiots even more than they are. Nope, it’s better to artifically keep the issue alive and have their freaks foaming at the mouth believing it may one day happen I will give the Dem leadership credit, they do know how to keep their mindless little minions dancing at the end of the puppet strings waiting for action that’s never going to happen.
The only thing this is going to do is what the Church Commission did in the 70’s, and that is to undermine the intelligence community and have them looking over their shoulder wondering if what the administration tells them to do today won’t land them in prison tomorrow. With this type of uncertainity, that’s just human nature. And the intelligence community operatives have no reason to trust BHO after this. None at all. And then when our intelligence gathering capability has all but depleted, something will happen like another attack, and these same types who are griping about how the intelligence community does it’s job will turn their griping back to claim they weren’t doing enough. You can’t please them, so why even try.
But, we need to be patient. The Bower-in-Chief is doing his best to make sure America is seen as a paper tiger……… again. And with this, he’s 99% there. At least that’s something he can definately hang his hat on as having accomplished in the first 100 days. It’s for our own good, you know.
micky says: I think Obama will do pretty much whatever needs to be done in a ticking time bomb scenario. This is not because I give him any credit but more because I believe he’s a follower when it comes to security matters as was made evident by the amount of Bush security policies he’s left in place.
The actions we see now are no more truthful than when he told his anti war base during the campaign that he would eliminate all the Bush security policies they hated so much. He’s kept renditions, wire tapping, bombing campaigns in Pakistan twice, just as much as I believe he will interrogate to what ever extreme is necessary because he knows that this dept. was Bush’s forte. He saw what worked for the last 8 years that kept us safe and is simply copying the exact same applications Bush would of applied to our enemies.
Obama will torture but in order to keep the peaceniks happy will lead everyone to believe that no such thing will ever occur, or has.
Really, look at his track record in this area, he’s a follower on security matters.
Homeboy had a rude awakening when he went for his first security briefing where the most sensitive info that only a select few know about was disclosed to him and since then he’s broken every promise he’s made to the anti war/Bush crowd.
I’d love to know what documents Sandy Berger stuck in his underwear and what was on them.
Did they show Clintons complete deriliction in dealing with the middle east, or was there proof that his administration was torturing terrorists who were caught during his little dust up in Yugoslavia ?
Its well known that the CIAs anti terrorism units was sending these guys to Egypt where they were “supposedly” tortured , put on trial and executed. hmm…
PenniePan says: We need to hold accountable by trial those who had the power, made the rules, and laid down the ‘new laws’.
George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzales.
If we had had leadership with integrity, not one based on lying and cheating, an underling who went rogue on torture would be in a position to be brought up on charges. And, in such a world, those at the top would, likewise, be in position to take action against these loose cannons. But not under Shrub. He walks as does Darth, Gonzales, and Rumsfeld.
“those same assurances don’t apply to bush administration officials who crafted the legal justification for the interrogation program.”
They were following the directives of Bush and are just as guilty. All who knowingly did this need to be prosecuted as fully as possible instead sipping cognac and playing golf somewhere in a gated community in f*kn Texas who will protect the azzholes by succession.
ubermawa says: This is sh*t. You can smirk all you want about the bug part but the real substance is that torture is as unconscionable as rape and “honor killings”. And trying to rationalize it or blow it off as “policy differences” is as depraved as trying to justify rape and “honor killings”. Wise up chump.
Ted provides an instructive example of conservative non-logic:
I’ve watched the left for so long that I agree, this is nothing but another faux-outrage based upon who was in office rather than what took place. If they had really cared about the Constitution (as they falsely claim they do), they’d have been all up in arms when Clinton lied to a Federal Judge.
Clinton. Ted excuses the torture memos by referring to Bill Clinton and his alleged perjury in regard to a dalliance with a consenting adult. Ah, well.
No one has said anything about Clinton at all. The Clinton administration is completely irrelevant to the conversation about the Bush torture memos.
Ted then goes on, in a display of omniscience, claiming to know what it is that motivates “the left:”
This are individuals who hate America, hate the Constitution, really hate GWB, hate conservatives,….. They just hate for the sake of hating. If they didn’t have something to hate, they’d invent it just so they could tear it down in hatred. They’re trash and deserve to be treated as such.
How he knows this, is unclear. But he’s right about one thing: I do hate Junior.
Ted gets close to the truth here:
There’s a reason the Dems haven’t and won’t go forward with any of this against anyone; they know their trial would be the laughing stock of the country, because they have no evidence, and it would make them look like total idiots even more than they are. Nope, it’s better to artifically keep the issue alive and have their freaks foaming at the mouth believing it may one day happen I will give the Dem leadership credit, they do know how to keep their mindless little minions dancing at the end of the puppet strings waiting for action that’s never going to happen.
Personally, I’m under no illusions about the courage or character of the Democratic leadership. They are cowards, hypocrites, and demagogues. Alas, the Republicans are even worse.
Ted then bemoans the consequences of the release of the memos:
The only thing this is going to do is what the Church Commission did in the 70’s, and that is to undermine the intelligence community and have them looking over their shoulder wondering if what the administration tells them to do today won’t land them in prison tomorrow. With this type of uncertainity, that’s just human nature. And the intelligence community operatives have no reason to trust BHO after this. None at all. And then when our intelligence gathering capability has all but depleted, something will happen like another attack, and these same types who are griping about how the intelligence community does it’s job will turn their griping back to claim they weren’t doing enough. You can’t please them, so why even try.
Note that, in this poorly-worded, inarticulate complaint, there is no mention of the Constitution or the rule of law. Ted claimed that “the left” hates the Constitution, then completely disregards it by dismissing egregious crimes against it by the Bush administration, which broke the law with its interrogation policy.
So, let me see if I can draw on Ted’s omniscient powers and get inside his limpid mind for a little channeling. Wish me luck:
The world, to Ted, is a dangerous place, full of enemies trying to take away his “freedom.” He has a deep-seated need to feel safe, a sort of innate desire to return to the warm, safe womb, to go back to his prenatal state which we must imagine was probably the only time he was ever happy. In a classic display of projection, Ted accuses “the left” of hating; he hates them for it. He sees himself as trash, and therefore knows that “the left” is trash. He lives in terror of the nameless, faceless terrorist. Everyday his fear tortures him. And therefore, these “terrorists” must, in turn be tortured. Constitution be damned!
Okay, that’s as far into Ted’s psyche as I dare go. It’s a scary, scary place.
ubermawa says: By the way, this wasn’t “just following orders”. This is getting a greenlight from the “top cop” that the actions are constitutional and a wink and a nod from his lying boss, George W. Bush.
Pattie says: The people (CIA, whomever) actually physically doing the torture and hearing the screams are souless. It is amazing they walk among us. I am all for the prosecution of these people as well as the Bush administration officials including Bush himself though that would be hard for the country to deal with.
I didn’t realize this was a right-wing blog when I googled this. There should be codes in Google or something. Now I have to fumigate.
Wow Dale, that was some major seething hatred and projection you did there. Do it again. For a little more effect, maybe next time through in some good kook conspiracy theories about how the WTC’s were brought down by explosive charges, or how the Iraqi war was planned years before GWB took office, or the Downing Street memos, or how PNAC is out to take over the world. As it stands, you almost qualify to be as crazy as the quacks on Indymedia.
I’m confident you won’t let us down.
micky says: “If we had had leadership with integrity, not one based on lying and cheating”
Yea, its going to be a long 3 years and 9 months.
” And trying to rationalize it or blow it off as “policy differences” is as depraved as trying to justify rape and “honor killings”. Wise up chump.”
So I guess you dont think it was worth it to get KSM a little wet so he would cough up names and the descriptions of almost 12 Al Qaeda operatives who were plotting attacks on us and other targets in Europe ? Its real convenient how the left always forgets about that one when they say torture is oh so terrible and never works. Interogating KSM gave officials a treasye trove of info that helped them prevent amny threats already in play
Tell me , what does constitute torture in your book ? A picture Of Bush while having your eyes taped open ? And if torture is so reprehensible do you think its fair that Obama persecute only the executives in Bushs cabinet ?
Rape an honor killings are crimes of self gratification, insecurity and power and cant for the life of me remember any times in history where they’ve saved a life.
But they do give me an idea for techniques that might prove useful
micky says: “The world, to Ted, is a dangerous place, full of enemies trying to take away his “freedom.” He has a deep-seated need to feel safe, a sort of innate desire to return to the warm, safe womb, to go back to his prenatal state which we must imagine was probably the only time he was ever happy. In a classic display of projection, Ted accuses “the left” of hating; he hates them for it. He sees himself as trash, and therefore knows that “the left” is trash. He lives in terror of the nameless, faceless terrorist. Everyday his fear tortures him. And therefore, these “terrorists” must, in turn be tortured. Constitution be damned!
Okay, that’s as far into Ted’s psyche as I dare go. It’s a scary, scary place.”
Yes, and 911 was an inside job
>>micky said: So I guess you dont think it was worth it to get KSM a little wet so he would cough up names and the descriptions of almost 12 Al Qaeda operatives who were plotting attacks on us and other targets in Europe?
Don’t be silly, terrorists who want to attack America have Constitutional rights, you know that. In fact, we deserve to be attacked given all the evil things our nation has done in the name of capitalism and greed.
For a group of self-proclaimed intellects, libs sure do have a problem recognizing just how easy they make it to pinpoint what motivates them, and it sure isn’t the Constitution or freedom or liberty.
In order to be consistent, they need to be calling for the head of BHO for not bringing “BushCo” to trial. In fact, they should already be marching in the streets demanding it by the millions. But will they? Nope. They don’t have permission to do so from their puppetmasters.
Jane says: As a citizen, I expect a complete accounting of the war crimes committed in my name with my money by the former leaders of my country and those under their command or oversight.
Accounting comes before accountability. I want to know — and I want everyone in the world, today and forever — to know who did what when.
We cannot let our humanity disappear for the sake of politics. I want Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Gonzales and all of their subordinates involved in the witch hunt and torture of those at Guantanamo and elsewhere under the sham of “Global War on Terror” put on public trial.
MICKEY: “Yes, and 911 was an inside job.” Glad you are starting to come to your senses.
Pat says: Obama should expedite prosecutions not waive them. After going to trial and should convictions ensue, the president then can choose to pardon or reduce any sentence of a particular torturer he feels is unjust — though I don’t see how any sentence for a torturer unjust.
DADE: By the way (and I am sure ROPE knows this) there has long been an active part of the radical right of Texas that supports succession from the Union. I think the number hovers around 25% so it is not insignificant. I would venture Perry’s comments were more “at home politics-driven “then in response to “Tea Party” melodrama. He just used the platform. He will be in a tough re-election race here and is more likely pandering to the right-wing radicals here at home.
micky says: “As a citizen, I expect a complete accounting of the war crimes committed in my name with my money by the former leaders of my country and those under their command or oversight.
Accounting comes before accountability. I want to know — and I want everyone in the world, today and forever — to know who did what when.”
First you have to define what is a “crime” which I’m willing to bet is nothing short of being a conservative.
We dont have the right to know every little piece of minutiae. And frankly, I dont want to know. How the hell are we supposed operate with any element of surprise with that kind of demand being honored ? And you talk about “sense” ?
Thats right, lets just have the ACLU right there embeded every step of the way with our troops so they cant even crap in peace and get written up for crumbling and not folding, or using more than one sheet.
Clinton was a big fan of “dont ask dont tell” so whats good for the goose…
“Glad you are starting to come to your senses.”
I’m sure you’re talking about my “sense” of humor.
Jane , try to understand that with your rationale being that the GWOT is a sham and that 911 was an inside job the level discourse I’ll give you is one to be categorized with pity which is why I wont be mean to you.
I wont try to discuss serious issues with you in search of any truth or answers but instead will engage you for the simple purpose of exposing to those unwitting souls what kind of people brought this idiot into office.
Jane says: Micky the condescension you show to me and anyone else on this blog who disagrees with you is remarkable. It is you alone who destroys any possible discourse here. It is you alone who destroys any engagement of issues. You browbeat, intimidate, and use bully tactics to get people to shut down or stay silent. Minds are not changed if that is what you think is happening.
If you really think you are “exposing” people here you are sadly mistaken. The only one you expose is yourself and that’s pathetic.
micky says: “Micky the condescension you show to me and anyone else on this blog who disagrees with you is remarkable”
Yea, its true that I diasagree with the delusional moonbats who think George W Bush would kill 3000 of his own citizens for his own gain.
Not only do I disagree with them I find them to be some of the most evil and/or sick people in the country, take your pick, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and stuck you in with the sick ones.
Because of that you deserve no respect from me or anyone for that matter and quite frankly if I had my way I’d of said more than I did.
The discourse you presented suggested that you be afforded the priveledge of knowing every act our defense forces make in protecting our country. And clearly shows that out some contemptuous hate you’re more interested in knowing what happens to your money than saving American lives.
I can only assume that you would expect all of us to be allowed the same priveledge which would open up our defense movements to anyone who wanted to harm us.
If you cant see how stupid and dangerous that is why should me or anyone worry about what kind of discourse you would care to be a part of ?
You like evryone else seems to think that bringing fact and truth to the conversation that destroys your argument is somehoe bullying or browbeating to the point where I have the power to get you to shut you down or make you silent.
How bout this ?
Instead of making up this kinda crap where I somehow have these telekenetic powers to make you sit down and shut up why dont you argue your point so as to convince me that what you suggest would work ?
Or at least try to tell me where I’m wrong .
At this point its you an all the 911 trufers who are the pathetic ones as there has never been one shred of credible evidence to support such a theory that 911 was an inside job and that the war on terror is a sham.
Are you aware of the history of radical Islam, the muslim brotherhood and how far back their attacks on us and the rest of the world go ?
Are you aware that there was a previous attack on the trade towers under the Clinton adminstration where no such asinine accusation was ever put on him and that it was connected to 911 by so much credible evidence its not even funny /
Obviously not.
Your life (and most libs as Ted was saying) is made up of a bunch of stories and occurances that you just make up like me having these powers, 911 is an inside job, the GWOT is a sham and i’m willing to bet you think Bush blew up the levees also.
You should be ashamed of yourself. To dislike the man is one thing, but to run around accusing someone of something you cant prove is the kind of thing that makes you worse than anything you could accuse him of.
Its called contempt prior to investigation and its the one thing so destructive in any society that our forefathers gave us legislation to prevent it from ever taking hold of our country.
People like you seek to destroy that and are the true “WITCH HUNTERS” !!!!
>>Jane said: Minds are not changed if that is what you think is happening
Is that why the libs come here, to try and get conservtives to see things from their POV? Really??
Given the various comments from the left on this blog, if it’s your desire that everyone fall in lock-step behind BHO for the good of the country, you certainly haven’t shown any knowledge on how to conduct a proper PR campaign.
As for me, and I’m betting most other conservatives here, I already know what the lib reaction is going to be on whatever topic kate chooses to highlight before the liberals here even post. Why would anyone want to have a discourse and/or engagement of the issues when you can map out what the left is going to say before they even say it? It’d be nice to actually see one of you have something to say that I can’t already find on the DNC website or, in the case of the 911 toofers, sites like infowars and/or 911truth.org. So far, none of you have.
lisab says: “It’d be nice to actually see one of you have something to say that I can’t already find on the DNC website …”
ummm … well … while we are indicting criminals, shouldn’t we prosecute obama for ordering the murder of three poor african teenagers? if torturing terrorists is bad, then murdering three poor african teens must be far worse.
micky says: Yea, I’m going to have a rational discussion maintaining a level discourse with someone who thinks the government orchestrated 911 so 3000 citizens could die along with thousands of servicemen who rose to the call.
I wonder what kind of discourse leads someone to vote for a president who thinks they’re nuts ? Even your own messiah doesnt believe the crap you spew !
As much as I dislike Obama and as much as he appeases out enemies even he is aware of the existential threat that they are. I mean really, the only conclusion that I can come to is that their vote for Obama was not one of support but rather one against and out of hatred for Bush. This is what happens when people make decisions based on contempt meant to hurt for spite sake and really do nothing for the country.
They make up these absurd stories and allegations like Jane does and suspect the military of fabricating and hiding evidence and then they turn around and make demands like hers to have total transparency in our defense deptartment
And these are the people crying for discourse ? Gimme a huge fricken break please !
Al-Qaeda is going to use this as a recruiting tool in this manner; now they know that the process the USA did use in order to obtain vital information has been dissolved. These were techniques of which they did not have the capacity to train their fighters to resist. Now they know that should they be captured, the BHO administration will attempt to get them to state their names and where they are from, but that’s about it. They know they’ll be given legal council, and they know the worst that will happen to them is to be imprisoned.
With this knowledge in hand, they can recruit fighers by pointing out how weak the Americans have become, and they can easily train their fighers how to overcome these simple-minded techniques. Our ability to obtain information from members of these group will be reduced to virtually nil. And should the country be attacked again after this new policy is in place, your anger, blame, and any action one should decide to take must be aimed directly at the BHO administration, members of Congress who approved of it, and the liberal citizens in this country who supported it.
Ken says: Poor neo-socialists, they just can’t move on. They’re so desperate to hide Obama’s failings that all they can do is continue to drudge up Bush every chance they get. Considering Clinton began rendition and eavesdropping all of this “outrage” is quite hypocritical, but expected.
micky says: Ted.
I noticed in the media yesterday on CNN and either CBS or ABC make attempts to sway people or distract them from the common sense explanation you just posted above.
Both hosted spokespersons that made similar disingenuous claims, one a professor saying that this was no big deal because our enemies have known for years what our interrogation techniques consisted of but they never mentioned to the viewers the point you made which was that now our enemies know just how far we’ll take things and that if they can hold out to certain point they’ll be in the clear.
The impression Bush’s policies gave our enemies was that you cant really be quite sure just how far we would take things.
Being in the chair with an interrogator under the Bush administration would have an element of uncertainty. Being that most people are afraid of the unknown, to sit there not knowing what’s going to be done next can be a very motivating factor for any detainee.
With Obamas policies they’re now aware that once they’ve made it through the linens washed with no softener stage they’ve completed the course.
Maybe its just wishful thinking or complete distrust but that little something way in the back of my mind that wants to give Obama some credit tells me that this is all just a front to keep anti war and human rights activist pacified and at a distance.
As I mentioned before, in the area of national security, Obama is a follower , not a leader and will more than likely maintain all of the policies in place by the previous administrations ( he kept almost all of Bushs) going back as far as Clinton who’s renditions placed detainees from Yugoslavia in Egypt. Gitmo is closing ? So what ? There’s always Bagrahm AFB in Afghanistan. We also have to remember that this administration is not the transparent one they said they would be. However, this doesn’t mean that he will act on new threats as forcefully and expeditiously as Bush would of. He’s still catering to our enemies with humility in some delusional hope that this approach will be what gets them to have some change of heart and no longer hate us. The threat of radical Islam will still grow as they are given a free pass by his naive benefit of the doubt.
>>Micky said: Maybe its just wishful thinking or complete distrust but that little something way in the back of my mind that wants to give Obama some credit tells me that this is all just a front to keep anti war and human rights activist pacified and at a distance…. We also have to remember that this administration is not the transparent one they said they would be.
That’s certainly a possibility and I wouldn’t totally discount it. Libs will sit there and wring their hands when their conscience is confronted, but if you can get certain things out of their sight, life goes on merrily as always.
I think that is why so many of them hated Bush, because Bush just laid it all out there. Obama will be loved by many for his dishonest subterfuges that will allow their consciences to rest blissfully and ignorantly.
micky says: The way I see it is this.
His policies on security were all screwed up until his first security briefing where afterwards he did a complete 180 flip and kept almost all of Bushs policies.
One of two things happened, or maybe both simultaneously.
At that briefing he saw the light, the truth, and crapped his pants while telling himself “DAMN !! Bush was right the whole time ! We cant take any chances when it comes to these guys !” or he never intended to follow thru on all the promises he made to the anti war/anti Bush base that supported him.
So, with that example in mind it wouldnt surprise me if hes just applying the same technique here to shore up votes from the base that hes recently pi$$ed off for 2010. This latest releasing of these memos is more or less an apology to that base that has recently lost faith because he flipped so hard on his campaign promise to oust Bush policy.
Its just a thought, but it goes a long way to his style.
He’ll still get us in trouble with these guys, no doubt. But what he does with them behind closed doors once apprehended will always be a secret, IMO.
micky says: “that example in mind it wouldnt surprise me if hes just applying the same technique here to shore up votes from the base that hes recently pi$$ed off for 2010.
should say 2012,
gravel kucinich paul nader says: This is the Lawyered-up Propaganda produced for mass consumption.
The REAL memos are leaking out all over the place ~
Thank you whistle blowers!
To a liberal, torture with a bug is genuinely awful. All those icky, germ filled crawly things with wings! Ugh!
This is why conservatives do so much of our nation’s fighting. They are the only ones that can endure a hardship without whining.
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