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barack obama has no intention of winning the war in afghanistan. you realize that don’t you? he clearly does not value being the commander in chief of our amazing military who even now are in harm’s way. he has only talked to general stanley mcchrystal, the general responsible for operations in afghanistan, once in the entire time he has been president. how do you do needs assessments that way? how do you listen to your generals on the ground? how do you win a war that way? you don’t. but you may get the olympics.
un.stinking.believable.
The Afghanistan war is lost. It’s been lost for years.
http://dadecariaga.blogspot.com/2009/09/defeat-in-afghanistan-another-colossal.html
Jane says: You are making more of this then it is. Barack trusts his military generals. He has a Pentagon. He has a DOD. What should he be doing? There is a lot on his plate domestically. Get off his back. As we all know, Afghanistan is never going to be winnable so why not cut our losses and come home. We can selectively target the Taliban and al-Queda terrorists in the mountain regions of that horrible country.
Paul says: We need to be concentrating on passing healthcare reform and getting the economy back on track. Afghanistan is now only a drain on resources we can no longer afford. BTW you can thank Bush for that.
BikerDan says: Well. I feel real safe under Obama’s watch. Could someone remind this pompous SOB that kids are DYING in Afghanistan because of his leftist inaction and inability to lead?
Uh…no, BikerDan.
Kids are dying because the war has been mismanaged for 8 years. Bush had a chance to win the war, but passed so he could have his Iraq adventure.
To repeat:
Remember early in the war, when the Taliban was in retreat, and the news wires were full of speculation that the US military had al Qaeda and Osama bin Laden holed up in Tora Bora? That may well have been the decisive moment of the war. A full scale offensive at that moment might have actually bagged bin Laden and much, if not all, of the al Qaeda leadership.
But, of course, there would have been significant US military casualties. And Junior and Cheney didn’t want to spend that kind of political capital on this Afghanistan sideshow. They had something much bigger in the works and they didn’t want to dull the American public’s appetite for war with reports and images of American service personnel killed in action. So they bid the job out to rival Afghan tribesmen, who, truth be told, had probably cut their own deal with bin Laden. Net result? Al Qaeda survives, but more importantly (from Junior’s perspective) so does the “war mentality” of the American public which Junior needed for his Iraq adventure.
Marsha says: How much more damage will this self-absorbed egomaniac be allowed to do to our nation before someone in power stands up and says “enough!”? Will that time ever come? How much more can we take? I read an article this morning that said America is very close to transferring our crown of “Leader of the Free World” to Israel because of BHO’s appeasement strategy with the enemies of the world. I am blown away at the speed in which he has been able to dismantle so many things.
Yeah Kate.
Its pretty obvious to anyone even with half a brain that if his gut were into he’d at least send in some reinforcements to help the troops there at the time.
Our highest body count yet and whats this a$$hole doing ? Waiting and pondering the lint in his navel as our men and women die uneccessarily due to lack of backing.
Jane, if he trusts them so much he’d pull his head out of his a$$ and go forward with the generals recomedations.
Paul.
I would thank Clinton before I thanked Bush seeing as how it was Clinton who allowed Afghanistan to become what it was before 911. All Bush was doing was dealing with Clintons deriliction of duty.
The Cole, Somalia, the first trade towers attacks were all on Clintons watch as the 5 years it took it to plan 911 took place in Afghanistan for 5 years under Clintons watch.
After Obama is down the road in a few years conservatives will have to go back to cleaning up what you morons now are obviously letting grow to pre 911 conditions again.
Obama has no plan, he’ll probably do what hes always done with national security matters. He’ll do what Bush would of done… I hope.
“We can selectively target the Taliban and al-Queda terrorists in the mountain regions of that horrible country.”
Are you going to selectively bomb the madrassas full of kids that the Taliban is indoctrinating ?
You seem to think that these guys only hang out in caves with their laptops. The Taliban is a part of societies everywhere from Afghanistan to Norther Pakistan and have taken such control that Pakistan doesnt even want to risk their own troops in that region. Its a part of the world where even the general population, not even the Taliban where 50% have a favorable view of Bin Laden, 50% approve of suicide bombing, its lawless and just another one of the many problems that goes beyond camel jockies in caves… wise up
So, let me see if I understand Micky: Afghanistan was going swimmingly up until January 20th, of this year. Right? As witnessed by the “free and fair” elections that just took place, right?
All due to Junior Bush’s visionary leadership, right?
“why not cut our losses and come home. We can selectively target the Taliban and al-Queda terrorists in the mountain regions of that horrible country.”
Make up your mind
Marsha says: Rant? Hell ya it is. Is that a problem here? Shall I spend the time to find the link for the article I read to give to you knowing you won’t read it anyway? Your buddy is a bust and you know it and I know. So when your buddy says:
“As President, I will make the fight against al Qaeda and the Taliban the top priority that it should be. This is a war that we have to win.”
Was he kidding? Naive? Stupid? Talking out his AZZ? Appeasing to moderates for the vote? Yea Dade all those things. Afghanistan is heating up just in last months he’s been in office and when the general asks for help BHO goes to talk Olympics. He is a waste.
“So, let me see if I understand Micky: Afghanistan was going swimmingly up until January 20th, of this year. Right? As witnessed by the “free and fair” elections that just took place, right?
All due to Junior Bush’s visionary leadership, right?”
Nice try but would you care to show me where the hell I said any such thing ?
I dont care what you say, the “fact” is that Afghanistan has never had so many casualties and been on such a crash course to failure as it has been under this morons watch… period !
Are you trying to blame decades of internal tribal corruption on Bush ?
Well, Marsha, if you want to rant, rant! Rage on! If it helps to ease your pain, rage on!
You’ll pardon me if I tune out, though.
Micky,
I’m blaming 7 years of mismanagement of Afghanistan on Bush. We won WWII in 4 years. Bush had 7 for Afghanistan and left it in a shambles.
Them’s the facts, son.
David says: Man, you Libs sure are cock sure about yourselves and every damn thing you every thought about. THATS the problem with the Left. They always think that they KNOW everything.
They know how EVERYTHING is going to turn out – whether it be that the war is going to be lost (remember that dumbass Harry Reid saying that the Iraq war was “lost”??) or that an unplanned pregnancy is “going to ruin your life” so you had better get an abortion. And on and on.
Sheesh.
Well, David, I think we can agree that there is plenty of self-righteousness on both the left AND the right.
Marsha says: Dade that’s fine. 🙂 Tune out to your hearts’ content!
And even though you’ve tuned out, a reminder that right now our country is really sick from the head down and we have BHO and the sheeple on the left to thank for it.
“blaming 7 years of mismanagement of Afghanistan on Bush. We won WWII in 4 years. Bush had 7 for Afghanistan and left it in a shambles.
Them’s the facts, son.”
Your perception of Bushs management is hardly a fact son, wise up.
The “F A C T” is that casualties have never been as high as they are under this administration
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/jul2009/afgh-j22.shtml
“The number of US/NATO deaths in July has already reached 58—the highest monthly toll since the invasion in October 2001”
hi dade
president bush, imo, never had the right number of troops in afghanistan because of the red hot problems in iraq – he tried though and spoke daily to his commanders in the field — that is well documented. but the war in afghanistan has been heating up in the last 9 months and the death toll has been going up dramatically. you can’t give obama a pass on afghanistan. by his own words he took the reigns of that war. military’s fight to WIN. by his very (in)actions he has plummeted morale on the battlefield making it more dangerous for everyone. his (in)actions on afghanistan have been shameful.
lisab says: casualties in afghanistan
year 2008 2009
jan 14 25
feb 7 24
mar 19 28
apr 14 14
may 23 27
jun 46 38
jul 30 76
aug 46 77
sep 37 68
so, what happened in january of this year that would make the casualties go up?
lisab says: it is also worth noting that the dems, such as the posters above, were all claiming iraq was lost … until it wasn’t.
now obama may indeed pull out of afghanistan, but that will be his choice. the deaths of tens of thousands that follows will be on tv every day … maybe not msnbc … but still, there will be no hiding the massacres of women and children.
all the deaths will be on obama and the dems.
lisab says: actually given obamacare’s low approval rating, 41% support to 56% oppose, i predict the dems will begin to break ranks unless obama can get support up.
voting for a health care benefit that will not take effect until 2013 is political suicide. they take all the heat, and get none of the benefits. once the dems were voted out of office the reps would just kill the bill.
if obamacare’s proposal drops to under 40% there is a good chance pelosi will lose her position as speaker
obama said this about Afghanistan/Pakistan during the 2008 presidential campaign:
“Yes, I think we need more troops. I’ve been saying that for over a year now.”
“We will kill bin Laden; we will crush Al Qaeda. That has to be our biggest national security priority.”
“[al Qaeda] are now operating in 60 countries. We have to go to the root cause, and that is in Afghanistan and Pakistan. That’s going to be critical.“
“…every intelligence agency will acknowledge that al Qaeda is the greatest threat against the United States and that Secretary of Defense Gates acknowledged the central front — that the place where we have to deal with these folks is going to be in Afghanistan and in Pakistan.”
“And until we do, Americans here at home are not going to be safe.”
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/26/debate.mississippi.transcript/
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/07/presidential.debate.transcript/
i guess as we’re all finding out, they must have been ‘just words’.
lisab says: the number of people who have died so far is nothing comapred to the slaughter that will occur if the taliban take over and take revenge on those who helped us.
not to mention it will free the taliban to go back to target iraq, pakistan, and ultimately the usa.
if obama pulls out of afghanistan, no one will help us if we are attacked again. they simply will not believe that obama will fight the terrorists.
Paul says: Well you all sound so brave don’t you? While you sit at your keyboards in the safety of your homes?
You all know it’s absolutely true that we lost any chance there was to help Afghanistan by destroying the Taliban and getting OBL and Mullah Omar the day the debate and the country’s resources turned to Iraq.
When the USSR left Afghanistan in the 1980’s Reagan didn’t give a crap about Afghanistan – drug production ramped up and the Taliban formed and took control of the country.
Same thing with Iraq. It’s clear from every honest report. Bush, Cheney & Rumsfeld wanted a bigger war and wanted revenge on Saddam for the Gulf War and the assasination plot on 41. They lost their way and lost Afghanistan NOT Obama.
Quit waving the flag as if you hold the moral high ground! It has blood on it from your party. Our Soldiers and their families are the ones that have paid that price.
PenniePan says: It’s only been a few months and he inherited a mess from Shrub and the Chickenhawks. Barack deserves our patience and the time to do the job in which ever way he says is right for the country. He says he’s skeptical about sending more troops and with good reason!! Why put more troops and money there when winning is not even part of the equation anymore? Talk about stupid and a waste.
I guess it’s time to remind you sniveling idiots AGAIN that elections have consequences and this is one of them.
Jane says: Let’s bring all the troops home while we can …. save money and lives.
so all of you libs just want to quit afghanistan.
its just like you liberals to rarely think of future consequences. none of us want war and we all hate to hear of one soldiers’ death or the awful atrosities that happen to the peaceful people who live under the boot of the taliban.
if we leave now, the taliban will be radically emboldened; would-be terrorists all around the world will feel empowered; our allies will think twice about us and our commitments on anything. our future safety and security will be in jeopardy and that’s a fact.
right now, these groups have to constantly look over their shoulders to plot and plan. take that away and they thrive unabated.
they are still out there you know. they hate us more then life itself. they are prepared to war with us for many, many years, as long as it takes them. they want a caliphate — to rule the world under one islamic leader, running the islamic flag over the WH. they say that not me.
you can call me a warmonger or whatever other paranoid label you want. i really don’t care. but imo, we need to continue the relentless pursuit of these terrorists to the very ends of the earth and kill them. that’s the only way our grandchildren will be safe.
No, Kate. You’re misrepresenting what “libs” are advocating. Or at least, what this “lib” is advocating.
First, this. You said: “if we leave now, the taliban will be radically emboldened; would-be terrorists all around the world will feel empowered; our allies will think twice about us and our commitments on anything. our future safety and security will be in jeopardy and that’s a fact.”
Which of course, is the same argument right-wingers used to make for continuing the war in Vietnam. And, they were right, eh? After all, the Soviet Union and Communist China went on to conquer the world.
I advocate finding a smarter, better, more efficient way to fight terrorism. Occupying a country at the cost of hundreds of billions of dollars, year after year, is not the way to do it.
BikerDan says: Dade say whatever you need to bro to deflect the impotency of Obama. The truth is that Obama blasted Bush for taking his eyes off the “real” war in Afghanistan. He said it was the war of necessity. Now he seems undecisive in how to proceed. Campaigning is always much easier than governing isn’t it?
Well said Katy but you understand that they just don’t get it? Most of them have never been to war and never seen the eyes: the eyes of the enemy and the eyes of the victims.
Ken says: “Which of course, is the same argument right-wingers used to make for continuing the war in Vietnam. And, they were right, eh?”
Well, unless you count the 6 million people who were butchered after the communists took over, but what the heck, you didn’t know any of them.
This argument, however, was dead on when we pulled out of Somalia. Obama used it as a recruiting tool declaring that America was a “paper tiger” and if given a bloody nose, would leave the fight. Sound familiar? It helped him recruit more people to his cause and emboldened him to strike at America. Leading up to that little incident called 9/11.
“I advocate finding a smarter, better, more efficient way to fight terrorism.”
Fair enough, but how?
“Occupying a country at the cost of hundreds of billions of dollars, year after year, is not the way to do it.”
Seemed to work with Japan, Germany, Bosnia, S. Korea. Speaking of Bosnia, don’t we still have troops there? What was Clinton’s “exit strategy” for that?
Ken says: “The truth is that Obama blasted Bush for taking his eyes off the “real” war in Afghanistan. He said it was the war of necessity. Now he seems undecisive in how to proceed.”
Exactly right, Dan. All the other mantra aside, that is what Obama said and know that he has the reins it’s “Its such a mess, we can’t fix it!!!”, that’s not what he said during the campaign, was it?
Ken says: “so, what happened in january of this year that would make the casualties go up?”
The Taliban’s candidate won.
Ken says: “Obama used it as a recruiting tool declaring that America was a “paper tiger” and if given a bloody nose, would leave the fight.”
That should read “Osama”. My apologies.
lisab says: kate,
first, the above posters are not “libs”, they are dems.
liberals do not endorse leaving women and children to be slaughtered by muslim terrorists, just for political gain.
second, the above posters are badly mistaken if they think the slaughter that occurs when we pull out won’t be blamed on obama and the dems.
lisa they call themselves liberals. i fear the liberals have left you behind.
come to the light. 😀
PenniePan says: This WAS the real war. Afghanistan is where the people who hit us on 9/11 were being sheltered. We know OIL, corporate interests, and revenge were why Bush really invaded Iraq instead of taking care of the terrorists in Afghanistan. That just infuriated the muslim world and they retaliated by multiplying like rabbits. All because of Bush!
Obama’s hope in Afghanistan was to drive out Al-Quaeda and try to create an environment where they could not return. Apparently with the results of the election he is rethinking this strategy as there does not seem to be a credible government to work with. He is trying to save lives and money instead of pissing it to the wind like Shrub and his Chickenhawks.
Hollie says: Many of you are so very wrong. Pres. Obama would prove he is an even greater man than his supporters now believe if he took the initiative to end the insanity in Afghanistan and exit immediately. I hope and pray he will do that. VP Biden has been right about it all along. The neo cons want nothing but continual war.
Jared says: Hm. I agree it’s now Obama’s war. But as I recall, it was Bushy’s war for 8 years before it was Obama’s. And if Bush hadn’t neglected it for 8 years to carry out his folly in Iraq, it might NOT be Obama’s war today. Obama hasn’t been in office for even one year and it’s absurd to expect that he could have sorted all Bushy’s folly out in that short of a time. Just like you neo cons to see pull out as abject failure in Afghanistan merely because you don’t like the results of the last election.
Lisa you are way too dramatic. You have no proof of what you say. Being in the Peace Corps hardly makes you an expert on anything other then the Peace Corps.
Ken says: “Being in the Peace Corps hardly makes you an expert on anything other then the Peace Corps.”
So by your logic, we shouldn’t listen to your opinion on Afghanistan, I mean, since you’ve never been there. Right?
lisab says: it makes no difference what jared says. if the usa pulls out there will be massacres. it happened when the soviets pulled out of afghanistan, it happened when we pulled out of laos, cambodia, and vietnam, it happened when the french pulled out of algiers, and it would have happened had bush pulled out of iraq.
perhaps it would not have been obama’s war had bush focused on afghanistan.
but it is obama’s war now. and unlike the killing fields or the vietnamese massacres of the mountain tribes …
this will be on tv, every day, and on youtube for years to come. since all you care about is obama’s political moves, consider his popularity and the dems popularity when women are being raped and then stoned to death every day on tv. you will still support him, but the independents will flee from the dem party like the cess pool it has become.
lisab says: and no amount of childish remarks on your part will change that.
“We know OIL, corporate interests, and revenge were why Bush really invaded Iraq ”
Oh my G*d. Any person with minimal knowledge would know that the oil could never be ours for the taking and would of been a hell of a lot cheaper just to buy it as right now the Iraqis are fighting among themselves to decide how its to be divided among the three sects. And in the meantime trying to figure out which members of their own parliament have shipped of present day Iraqi oil revenues to offshore accounts.
Your “WE” is a very small population of idiots.
” That just infuriated the muslim world and they retaliated by multiplying like rabbits. All because of Bush!”
You guys need to make up your freeking minds.
Is this the war to be won as Obama says or are you going to worry about pissing off those who want you dead ?
“Obama’s hope in Afghanistan was to drive out Al-Queda and try to create an environment where they could not return. Apparently with the results of the election he is rethinking this strategy as there does not seem to be a credible government to work with.”
The credibility of the government there has never been in question.
As he “re thinks his strategy (more appropriately tries to weasel out of his campaign lies) our existing troops are being killed due to a lack of support.
So much for supporting the troops. They need reinforcements plain and simple per McChrystal or the will fail. That means “lose”
He is trying to save lives and money
Yes, he needs the additional funs to pay for his bullsht healthcare at the cost of human lives as last months casualties were the highest ever.
Find some information sometime, would you ?
————————————————————————————————
We need Pakistan to chase the SOBs back up into Afghanistan so we can identify and kill them. From there, as un-pc as it might sound, we need to engage in a massive nation building campaign where we educate the moderate populations to the benefits of democracy, help rebuild an economic infrastructure that doesn’t involve opium. Afghanistan has what it takes, farming lands, grazing etc, could well become the middle east hub for as much agriculture as it takes to support many markets across the middle east. With economic and civil freedoms will come many hearts and minds. Much as was the case with Iraq, the people finally came to realized what was right and turned on the insurgencies, Al Queda, Iranian Kud forces,
Unfortunately since the Afghan winter is due soon most resistance will fade until things warm up again which makes the first thing we must do impossible for months to come. So, I think the only real option left in the next few months if you want to talk about “re-evaluating” a strategy goes would be to get the Pakistanis to either let us cross into the northern zone or have them get off their asses and chase these bastards to a killable location
We have to get the resistance out of the way before we can proceed with anything.
We cannot afford to just pack it up, that would be insanity
casseopia says: afghanistan is not worth one more life. the sooner we get out the better. i am sorry for those left behind who may be killed but we can no longer be all things to all people.
Edward says: If we leave now, the Taliban could take the country and provide deeper sanctuary to Al Queda. Maybe we have to live with that possibility as opposed to staying for as long as it takes for the Afghani’s to get their own act together. That won’t ever happen.
I like that President Obama waited for a thorough review of the situation on the ground and the results of the election, and is now reviewing the strategy now that he has more facts. He doesn’t just blab like Junior or start another war, forgetting the first. I also think that the country is too primitive and systemically corrupt for us to make a real difference.
Ken says: The level of ignorance shown by democrats, particularly the ones who are commenting on this site, is staggering.
I love seeing that liberal “compassion” of those left behind in Afghanistan. “Oh well, sorry you stood by us, but we’re going to leave you at the hands of the Taliban.” Excellent idea! I’m sure the next time we need cooperation of that sort, that won’t come back to haunt us at all. It’s the same reason they don’t care when 6 million people were slaughtered after we left S.E. Asia.
The dems have absolutely no vision beyond today and that has always cost more lives in the long run, but don’t expect to hear it from them.
God help us all.
David says: Jared said, “Just like you neo cons to see pull out as abject failure in Afghanistan merely because you don’t like the results of the last election.”
THAT is the tactic of the left, Jared. Quiting. Pulling out. Leaving things unfinished.
On a similar note, you can bet that if this “health care reform” gets passed, the DEMS and the left will then ABANDON any paying attention to it as it then goes on to torture the U. S. Citizenry for years. They just want to win for the day (the vote to pass it) then the rest is “who cares”… that’s the left’s M.O.
“afghanistan is not worth one more life. the sooner we get out the better. i am sorry for those left behind who may be killed but we can no longer be all things to all people.”
So what respect goes to all the ones who’ve died already ?
Be all things to all people ?
What f*cking planet are you from ? This about defeating “O U R ” enemy, not being anything else to anyone else you buffoon.
Complete fricking ignorance like I’ve never heard… yet
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